Sea Breeze

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Posts by Sea Breeze

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  21

  Dr. Bart Ehrman Live Webinar Did Jesus Call himself God?

  by Diogenesister in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  there's a live webinar with dr. ehrman on the subject of the divinity of jesus.

  folks will be able to put questions directly to dr. bart, the cost is $14.00 with the webinar covering the following topics:.

  • soon after jesus’ death, his disciples claimed that he was god .

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  Sea Breeze

  I know that Ehrman is a self described agnostic leaning atheist. So, he doesn't have a dog in this race. But, even he marginalizes those that would say that the man whom the entire earth counts their years by never existed.

  I don’t think there is any doubt that Jesus existed. There are a couple of scholars who’ve argued he didn’t exist. There are a lot of voices out there saying that he didn’t exist. But they’re not by scholars who are actually trained in any historical disciplines. There are voices on the internet. But there are voices on the internet for all sorts of things. Scholars who study this stuff really, there isn’t any, it’s not a question that’s debated among my colleagues. It is not debated. Because the evidence is so overwhelming. - Bart Ehrman
  
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  162

  A new generation of anointed that will not pass away.

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  obviously, the older “ anointed ” from 1914 died.

  and because they were anointed, they hopefully went to heaven.

  in the first century though, a newer generation did not replace the old.

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  Sea Breeze

  You talking about the Hawking that once said this? Great minds think alike. Sounds like you found what you looking for.

  
  
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  162

  A new generation of anointed that will not pass away.

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  obviously, the older “ anointed ” from 1914 died.

  and because they were anointed, they hopefully went to heaven.

  in the first century though, a newer generation did not replace the old.

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  Sea Breeze

  Wow, it didn't take long for your "yearning" to turn into yawning.
  
  Just a little tidbit from the chap who invented / discovered calculus:

  

  “This most beautiful system of the sun, planets and comets, could only proceed from the counsel and dominion of an intelligent and powerful Being...
  This Being governs all things, not as the soul of the world, but as Lord over all; and on account of his dominion he is wont, to be called Lord God παντοκρατωρ or Universal Ruler.”

  
  ― Isaac Newton, The Principia: Mathematical Principles of Natural Philosophy
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  162

  A new generation of anointed that will not pass away.

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  obviously, the older “ anointed ” from 1914 died.

  and because they were anointed, they hopefully went to heaven.

  in the first century though, a newer generation did not replace the old.

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  Sea Breeze

  belief in a personal God (including YHWH and Christ), is hindering human progress and hindering human flourishing.

  I guess this explains your total lack of interest in even attempting to defend your new philosophy when questioned like I did in my last post:

  Scientific Naturalism assumes that we are in a closed system. Since there is no way of testing this, it torpedoes its own foundation before it even gets started doesn't it?

  If it is closed, the where did the information come from that is inherent in light, matter, DNA, etc come from ?

  But, this isn't really about promoting or defending scientific naturalism is it? It is really about you being troubled that Christians don't vote like you do, right?

  So why don't you just stop beating around the bush and start a topic on a political issue that you think you can defend?

  But several months ago the creator and moderator of this site placed a block on my account from me creating new topic threads on this site. As a result, on this site I can only post in already existing topic threads and there are few new topic threads on this site promoting naturalism.

  Were you told this? Or, is this something you assumed? Maybe you don't know how to do it. You won't be able to post until you select a subject area. Have you tried this?
  
  
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  52

  Free Will - Does It or Does It Not Exist?

  by truth_b_known in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  being born-in and raised as one of jehovah's witnesses i remember a common theme or phrases used by the watchtower in its theory of why things are the way they are -.

  jehovah created humans.

  jehovah created humans as free moral agents.

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  Sea Breeze

  "Free Will cannot exist as every outcome is completely determined by the given set of conditions"

  Assumptive, not scientific.
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  162

  A new generation of anointed that will not pass away.

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  obviously, the older “ anointed ” from 1914 died.

  and because they were anointed, they hopefully went to heaven.

  in the first century though, a newer generation did not replace the old.

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  Sea Breeze

  I agree VH7. I will gladly remove the below post if DJW would start a new thread on Scientific Naturalism. If this is his yearning to get other adherents like he says... he shouldn't be afraid of honest discussion.

  Anyway, For most people, naturalism assumes materialism. Note what Stanford Encyclopedia says:

  Naturalism

  First published Thu Feb 22, 2007; substantive revision Tue Mar 31, 2020

  The term “naturalism” has no very precise meaning in contemporary philosophy. Its current usage derives from debates in America in the first half of the last century. The self-proclaimed “naturalists” from that period included John Dewey, Ernest Nagel, Sidney Hook and Roy Wood Sellars. These philosophers aimed to ally philosophy more closely with science. They urged that reality is exhausted by nature, containing nothing “supernatural”, and that the scientific method should be used to investigate all areas of reality, including the “human spirit” (Krikorian 1944, Kim 2003).

  So understood, “naturalism” is not a particularly informative term as applied to contemporary philosophers.

  As far as most people are concerned, I believe that the three major components to naturalism are 1) scientism — the belief that scientific knowledge is either the only form of knowledge or a vastly superior form of knowledge; 2) the belief that the atomic theory of matter and the theory of evolution explain all events; and 3) the belief that non-physical things don’t exist and that the world isn’t here for any purpose.

  Scientific Naturalism assumes that we are in a closed system. Since there is no way of testing this, it torpedoes its own foundation before it even gets started doesn't it?
  
  If it is closed, the where did the information come from that is inherent in light, matter, DNA, etc come from ?

  Scientific Naturalism is a dead end.
  
  
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  162

  A new generation of anointed that will not pass away.

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  obviously, the older “ anointed ” from 1914 died.

  and because they were anointed, they hopefully went to heaven.

  in the first century though, a newer generation did not replace the old.

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  Sea Breeze

  I yearn for the vast majority of human society, including the vast majority of humans of western civilization, including the vastly majority of humans of the USA, to embrace scientific naturalism.

  DJW, are you aware that neither you nor any other atheist can argue against the reality of non-material things without using non-material things?

  It's like someone arguing that there's no such thing as oxygen, while breathing the whole time. It's almost like arguing that there's no such thing as arguing! When a materialist argues that only the material realm is real, that only material things exist, he cannot do that without using ideas, which Einstein pointed out are not physical.

  Like numbers, ideas themselves are not physical, yet are very real. They're not made of matter and they're not made of energy. Regardless of how much we use them or how often, they never run out and they never wear out. Numbers are without limit and do not have temperature, density, color, mass, volume, shape, a melting point, hardness, odor, length, etc. They lack the properties of matter and energy, and even of space and time.

  Here are a few other things that are outside of a materialist naturalism worldview:

  - Math is not physical.
  - Information is not physical.
  - Grammar is not physical.
  - Logic is not physical.
  - Reason is not physical.
  - Ideas are not physical.
  - Language is not physical.
  - Science is not physical.
  - Morality is not physical.
  - Truth is not physical.
  - Probability is not physical.
  - Souls are not physical.
  - Spirits are not physical.
  - Concepts are not physical.
  - Codes are not physical.
  - Loyalty is not physical.
  - Love is not physical.
  

  Light and matter itself travel as a mathematical probability wave that collapses into particles upon observation. Where did the information come from ? Why does observation trigger its transformation?

  A materialist naturalism world-view describes very little of our experience. Why would anyone buy into this as some sort of oasis of truth? There must be a larger reality that includes materialism and naturalism as part thereof, but at the same time accounts for the things it doesn't explain.

  I'm curious, Why do you yearn for others to join you in naturalism? What would this do for you if they did?
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  5

  How can JW's have a CLUE what the New Covenant is about...

  by BoogerMan in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  ...when their "slave class" doesn't?.

  it-1 p. 524 covenant - the covenant is forever in operation.... it-1 p. 524 covenant - the purpose of the new covenant requires that it continue in operation until all of the “israel of god” are resurrected to immortality in the heavens.. the new covenant is forever in operation, but only until the "anointed" have popped their clogs, been raptured to heaven, and morphed into 144,000 melchizedek king-priests.

  (just like christ!).

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  Sea Breeze

  Now, of course, I know it's because the WBT$ prints mentally retarded refuse.

  https://archive.org/details/allaboutonerusse00cook

  The above link is to a booklet written only 2 years after Russell started printing the WT. Local Pastors exposed the theological illiteracy and obvious deception of Russell's writings the best that they could, which was substantial.

  Russell comes off as an incredibly uneducated self absorbed liar, a narcissist who believed that he found himself prophesied in scripture.

  Local pastors were very concerned and refuted his nonsense for decades. But there was no internet back then and the WT simply out-printed them. The fact is that there was a vast market of uneducated and unchurched adherents that bought into :

  1. No judgement after death

  2. A second chance in paradise after you die.

  3. Complete non-existence if somehow you didn't make the team

  4. Confirmation that you are really smarter than all your educated peers.

  5. You are not fake like everyone else. You are honest-hearted.

  6. You get to take credit for your good works as opposed to Christianity where you do not.

  It was religion for the working man who was free of incumbrances like education, logic and sound doctrine. On my mom's side of the family, the first convert was an immigrant with a 3rd grade education. My dad was a Mississippi farm boy who didn't finish High School and started reading WT literature while stationed in Alaska during near 24 hr. darkness in winter.
  
  
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  52

  Free Will - Does It or Does It Not Exist?

  by truth_b_known in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  being born-in and raised as one of jehovah's witnesses i remember a common theme or phrases used by the watchtower in its theory of why things are the way they are -.

  jehovah created humans.

  jehovah created humans as free moral agents.

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  Sea Breeze

  What about babies who are still inside their mother? Do they have a right to choose to live?

  Excellent question. Those that claim they are pro-choice really seek to eliminate the free-will of those they would like to cancel.
  
  
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  52

  Free Will - Does It or Does It Not Exist?

  by truth_b_known in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  being born-in and raised as one of jehovah's witnesses i remember a common theme or phrases used by the watchtower in its theory of why things are the way they are -.

  jehovah created humans.

  jehovah created humans as free moral agents.

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  Sea Breeze

  There needs to be an agreement on what the terminology means.

  Free Will doesn't mean that we are without influences, temptations, predispositions, context, etc. The fact that we can choose in spite of (as well as because of) such things is only further evidence of free will.

  Furthermore, if we choose not to exercise our free-will, that is an expression of free will as well.... just as making excuses is also a choice and an act of free-will.

  Animals exhibit some volition, but are generally void of moral choices. We are capable of making moral choices whether we choose to admit it, or choose to engage in it or not.